if you're regularly posting about how you hate gooners you're just pornbrained with extra steps

@3 this applies to a lot of things where if you post about it too compulsively it becomes an undignified act of subordinating yourself to a demon. realizing this is what got me to stop femcelposting

second strike

@nyx @3 "defining yourself in opposition to something is a parasitic relationship"

@winterklaus @3 are you quoting something or just decoding my sphinx riddles

@FiringSquadsEnjoyer this was about u btw

@3 remember when people used to pretend to be radfems on here?

@FiringSquadsEnjoyer @3 I've gotta be honest, having been on that "we need to bring back radfem" shit for like a decade I think it's a complete dead end in the sense that people treat it like an ideological label the same way people call themselves "socialists" or "anarchists" or whatever these days as a way to signal opinions they have rather than a theory that has been informed by its practical usefulness and engagement with past movements. in the case of radfem, it obviously failed, and it had all sorts of problems, and I think that a lot of the appeal it has had for people in the last few years mostly comes down to it being sort of scandalous and edgy after however many decades of the "feminist" label being captured by libfem, and also because it appeals to puriteen types.

I'm just so fucking tired of all this ideological wankery. no one actually *does* anything, it's all just posting bullshit on the internet. you should read radfem stuff, engage with the herstory of women's writing and all that, but it's a dead end to act like we can simply resurrect radfem and that'll be the key to liberation. this thinking is all fundamentally detached from reality as far as I can tell.

@FiringSquadsEnjoyer seek help genuinely unironically. like please. i know i've been clowning on u kind of hard but i don't know how else to make you pause and reflect on all your shitty takes. it is glaringly obvious all your posturing and virtue signaling is coming from places of repression and projection and you need to move past your internalized transphobia because it permeates all the shit you write. find some trans woman who doesn't spend all her time on /tttt/ and ask her what it is like being trans because if your experience is only trying to be "one of the good ones" and spending all your time around people who hate you and trying as hard as possible to make them stop hating you you'll never get to indulge in the simple pleasures of life without this crippling self consciousness about the "optics" of people in mental health crises who live worlds away from you. i hope you grow and learn to love and accept yourself and realize you don't have to be ashamed of anything other than doing harm to others. now get out of my replies and go talk to someone who loves you for who you are rather than for what you like

even if you were right, you've done such a piss poor job of arguing that you have entirely eroded what little ground you had to stand on. i don't want to hear more about your opinions. i want you to feel the sun kiss your cheek and grass between your toes without wondering whether being barefoot makes you a footfag

@3 doing the "im actually just concerned for your mental health thing" after spending days dogpiling someone with a dozen or so others and then tagging them back afterwards is just ridiculous on the face of it. Im not the one who came into your replies, i didn't even see this post until you tagged me under it earlier.

@3 also the idea that thinking incest is bad and opposing legalisation is just a terminally online obsession, while in the real world all the normies are talking about how they believe in the incest rights movement or something is insane. Go outside to a park or something and tell a stranger that you're trying to get signatures for a petition legalising incest and they'll be disgusted and repulsed by you.

@3 @FiringSquadsEnjoyer hell yeah xenofem.me on xenofem.me dogfighting

@3 i dont care about trans people ruining their own optics with incest posting, i care about people coalescing to defend the claim that incest should be decriminalised because it overwhelmingly leads to incest victims becoming traumatised maladjusted people.

Incest is a meaningfully harmful awful thing and people talk about it online like its just some meme or kink or something, I'd be deeply upset by cis people saying everything you and others have said in the various threads because they're upsetting horrible positions to hold, if anything I'd be more upset because cis people have more societal power to actually get away with committing, perpetuating and trying to decriminalise incest.

@3 and if you don't care about incest why come into the replies of people who do vice-signalling about how cool it is? Would you go into the vegan thread and repeatedly post about how cool it is that people can eat steaks and sausages and cheese and call us mentally ill losers for caring and getting upset or angry about it, and like post memes about how funny you find it to eat a bacon cheeseburger

@3 just as carnism inevitably leads to the widespread sexual assault of animals so too does incest lead to the widespread sexual assault or borderline sexual assault of children. People online love posting about how the "idea of the pedophile" of a looming Peter Loore M type in the fog searching for kids is perpetuated by conservatives to promote the idea of the family under attack (as opposed to a friend, guardian or family member opportunistically indulging themselves), right up until you say "maybe we should put guardrails in front of these friends, guardians and family members".

@3 i deleted it bcs i overshared, sorry for the inconvenience.

@3 but yes, we cant really conceive of incest without child molestation / grooming bcs at every level its inextricable, even between a fully consenting mother and son both of age there's a lifetime of grooming in advance of it happening. Between a sibling and a younger sibling too, the plurality of self reported csa cases are of underage kids having sex with and then raping another underage kid, with the legalisation of incest it just becomes a case of hiding it until adulthood, and then revealing their "new" fully legal relationship to the world. Iirc i laid this out at some point in the thread but buried behind a load of other replies.

@FiringSquadsEnjoyer @3

The information and rhetoric is on your side on the actual grounding of this issue. from a 2003 article *Incest: A Feminist Core Issue that Needs Re-politicizing* (https://rapereliefshelter.bc.ca/incest-a-feminist-core-issue-that-needs-re-politicizing-2/) it points out that the pushback on the 'medicalist and amerikkkan normalization of this topic' ambiguates patriarchal assault practices. usually it is 'normal fathers' that will begin doting on the child more and more when they are fighting with their mothers as a way to 'get back' at them.

"In fact, this trap set for mothers is unexplainable except as terrorism – these mothers are bearing the brunt of the rage that is out there at women who commit the sin of naming men the offenders.

And so the subject of incest is now permitted speech. But the issue – the naming of who is doing what to whom and why – is not permitted speech. This is implicit in the model of social response – to speak of the “horrors of incest,” while adhering to a policy that sets greatest store in protecting nice middle class men’s reputations. I hope it is not too cynical to suggest also that endless “treatment” for an unending stream of survivors is quite capitalism-compatible."

To pull on this and step away from the 'father-daughter' assault dynamic I will talk about other places I've seen it show up. I have had experiences with seeing cousins and brothers assault the women in their family at a young age. An act that usually gets covered up or ambiguated by the family because honestly no family wants to take a private matter into the hands of the law. From this position it can seem like the only form in which you can meaningfully pushback against it is to keep it criminalized as a sort of post hoc shunning practice. To complicate the matter, some of these people have ended up realizing they are transwomen which creates an unfortunate situation between a patriarchal and non-punitive past and their social present. There are other anecdotes I've heard of people who are transwomen being assaulted in similar ways by their sisters. What has to be understand is that incest is usually an act of bizarre and dysfunctional vengeance, it is usually a harm. However your main audience Rose is not some heteronormative trannies but people who are anti-male, anti-carceral, and to a large extent anti-family. You have to realize where we are at before trying to shame down on us how we should be. When you take it in the context like this it seems sensible that its a defiance of the eugenicist framework of 'wronglove' rather than a testament to family.

This is the point I want to appeal to you personally about Rose. You need to figure out how to broach your feelings on this with your perspective on *law in general* for one. Because clearly carceral shame is not a functional response to this problem. You need to realize that when other people are trying to dodge it it is because they are suspicious that the law isnt working for them.

More importantly, and in fact this is why I am reaching out to you here, I urge you to reassess your relationship with others here. You are speaking to them as if they are already doomed to the fate of being wrong, which is creating a spiral of deep alienation. Instead of reaching out to them and saying 'this isnt right theres so much information that complicates your perspective here' you are taking the path of the crusader 'how dare you act like this, and why is everyone here betraying me'. Frankly, you lost favor with the public the moment you made that lowblow about insinuating that their belief is a patriarchal 'malebrained' belief which falsely assumes that women can not be ignorant on the ways patriarchy controls them. You really should apologize for that. The reason people didnt tell you that at the time is because we were worried the dogpiling and scrutiny would alienate you further.

Feminism is not something you 'are' its something you learn and constantly build upon with others. When other people call themselves feminists, communists, etc. You should not see them as 'know it alls' but rather eager participants that are willing to cooperate with you on the issue of learning.

Xenofem for me represents that incredibly cooperative approach to communist, feminist, and trans-radically autonomous beliefs. People here are going to be stupid most of the time. They are going to talk about how they are communist but not know various things. Thats fine, its to be expected, that means work is to be done and people are willing to do it. Your goal should not be to shame your fellow woman but to bring them up to your level. Keep it together sister. I'm with you.

@FiringSquadsEnjoyer @3 i want to follow up this by pointing out that the reason I finally broke the seal of reaching out and speaking to you is a pure admiration for what you've been doing here. I genuinely was worried a dogpiling and scorning on you would make you freak out and disappear but youve been steadfast in reaction to deeply snide psychological comments and general mockery. this is one of the brilliant stubbornesses of an englishwoman against her own crown. I am very fond of the fact you arent being led astray here but I'm merely trying to indicate to you that your presumptions are fatalistic.

I only try not to speak with you to often because you have a tendency towards being upset and I dont want to contribute unintentionally to that upset, but shouldn't forget that you belong here and what you add is valuable. even if you wont reach out to trinity, even if youre going to be mean and bitter 8 times out of 10 you ought to be aware that you really do belong here and there are things about you that are admirable. a stubborn englishwoman against their own crown is a beautiful asset to the causes you advocate for. dont diminish yourself.

@Erato_Heti @3 thank you for this, I appreciate your more measured tone on this and you not just calling me crazy, im sorry btw for being rude to you in the past. The article was a good read, I hadn't considered that my choices of specifically invoke "mother-son" relationships as a more relatable depoliticisation away from feminism (because i felt i wasn't talking to any), to be the exact same perpetuating of the Peter Loore M 'Spectre of the Pedophile' rather than the father himself that I invoked before but this time an evasion within the family rather than pointing outwards from the family.

@Erato_Heti @3 btw im glad you liked The Bounty, i saw your 4.5 score for it on letterboxd

@FiringSquadsEnjoyer i didnt know you were following me on letterboxd :0

I usually use just a 4 point scoring system so it just means 'good but cant give all the accolades' ie the polynesian 'savagery' scene was really bad, and on that note lacking in speech from any subject but the tahitan leader undermined the movie a little for me.

but i liked the film otherwise and thought it reflected a more intensely 'mediocre' reflection of the colonial voyage. the best way I can describe it is as 'the type of movie I really want to put on a cinephiles radar' (like my buddy comrade yui). I was actually suprised to see nobody in my own orbit there had the movie marked for watched or intending to watch. it was the closest I got to wanting to openly write a review bringing it to peoples attention in a while.

@Erato_Heti i saw it more as a battle between entirely clashing views of society and the world with the middle class striver forcing himself into iron discipline even when nobody but himself is following it against the upper class man who takes society for granted and sees no need for it fitting in perfectly with the thieves, murderers and pressganging victims that would make up the crew of a ship of the time who knew no better vision of the world, gradually betraying everything and their entire lives for momentary pleasures until they're stuck on that horrid rick Pitcairn. Basically a movie about being an alcoholic / sex addict imo through the lense of a ship movie.

@FiringSquadsEnjoyer as far as everything else, im glad you see what I was going for and I thought the hopscotching of pathologization around you was in very poor taste.

thats why I tried to hone in on where I think things were derailing from (which, lets be fair, is not some piety within me but simply because I had time to watch and meditate on the response while it was getting worse). ive had you muted for a while just as a reminder to myself not to talk to you and upset you but I felt like it was worth chiming and reassuring you a little. im glad youre willing to overlook our previous crude interactions. just keep in mind that my curse to bear is and likely always will be that I'm an alcoholic from amerikkka 😵‍💫. the rest of my behaviour follows sensibly from there.

i honestly cant speak to the ability of this space to resolve its own indemnities, its very possible you are right that this is a doomed space of rude hypocrites, but obviously I try to push through that and remain here so that I dont get harassed in more openly patriarchal social spaces. i will trade the occasional mockery my way for the conciousness raising that I imbue with this place with but thats just me. i dont want my intervention to be some way to persuade you to *stay here* or whatever. you are free to find whatever best fits you. but even with our spats spoken for and the general reputation of us both I still very much do care about my fellow woman here and see us pushing against a common enemy.

@FiringSquadsEnjoyer thats a great interpretation of it and I'm very in favour of that class analysis obviously, and relation to addiction. the perspective of the prolitarian impulse cannibalizing itself is accurate and it does work that way. its why I dont mind that the movie is 'tedious'. somebody said the ending of the movie was very 'lovecraftian' as we were watching it, and i thought that was accurate considering how fucking annoying and tedious a lovecraft protagonist gets by the end.

@Erato_Heti @FiringSquadsEnjoyer @3 now that's a great xenofem post

@Erato_Heti watched it with someone who's main point of upset along the way (like many of the top letterboxd reviews) was Captain Bligh calling the Polynesians savages and its a rightful thing to get upset over, but it reflects the whole thing of online leftists frequently doing the lowkey autistic thing of excusing completely horrible maladjusted behaviour in general as long as it doesn't knock into any of the relegated 'tripwires' of being overtly racist/homophobic/religiously intolerant.

@FiringSquadsEnjoyer oh no the issue with the polynesian scene was not that bligh calls them savages its that they dont show who they are rather than as a force surrounding them and then killing one of their men. my issue is that the movie introduced an interesting biographical subplot and wrapped it up in the same scene through a senseless nativistic lens. take in mind that bligh is going on about how they have cannibalism down to a science either before or after that scene (i dont remember exactly). i dont have an offense to it because bligh is saying it bligh sucks the movie is meant to lead you to the idea that bligh sucks.

@FiringSquadsEnjoyer this is an issue I tend to have with film just in general. im the type of girl thats like 'make every movie 4 hours long to finish all of what you brought up, otherwise ill just watch short films'

@Erato_Heti oh yeah, i mixed up the polynesians and the tahitans

@FiringSquadsEnjoyer oh yea my issue with the tahitans is pretty soft. its true that they also 'kill' a guy to but the point of the scenes with him is that hes really just more dying as result of being a deadbeat alcoholic loser than anything the tahitans are doing to him. that guys death is meant to be a 'ok we are leaving now' thing and I think it worked fine. I just think running the whole of that dialogue through 1 leader kinda sucked.

on that same note I do actually like that the tahitan leader was kind of an opportunistic asshole. it fits the point that colonialism does not actually wedge itself without some leaders at least accepting exchanges in which leave them worse off. but thats why it sucked because obviously the leader wasnt really fit to be speaking for everyone. i think it would have been nice to have some back and forths of disagreement from various tahitans that werent hooting and hollering.

@3 @FiringSquadsEnjoyer i mean tbh my issue with incest is that family dynamics are already volatile and that if incest doesn’t cause/end with manipulation, it will cause/end with someone being otherwise harmed. idk if this is enough to advocate for incest’s illegality, i’m no incest expert (so i could be wrong,) and i do still see the point in “if it’s two adults it’s probably cool,” but still

@Erato_Heti @FiringSquadsEnjoyer holy shit wait a fellow four point scoring enthusiast??? i love four point scoring!!!!

@shroomie @FiringSquadsEnjoyer ive been like that for over a decade now. On 10 point scaling systems i use the 9 and 10 point bits to artificially boost the rating of those art profiles. Not because i think im a superior critic or anything but because what I pay attention to is usually so obscure that its worth giving as much of a boost to it as possible.

@Erato_Heti @FiringSquadsEnjoyer hell yeah